JELANI COBB: I wanted to kind of go through something that we shot the other day. And it’s of an encounter—

Sgt. CONZENTINO:With the gang unit or—

OFFICER:Yo! Yo!

YOUNG MAN:Don’t touch me, bro. Don’t touch me. Hold up!

YOUNG MAN:Hold up! Hold up! Hold up! I’m not doing nothing! I’m not doing nothing! Come on, man! Come on, come on.

OFFICERS:Stop. Stop. Stop. You want to pull away from me man? You’re going to get hurt. Stop.

OFFICER:Cuff him for safety.

YOUNG MAN:I didn’t do nothing.

OFFICER:Stop. Just stop, sir. Just stop.

NATE LHOWE:Sir, you’re not under arrest. This is just for your safety and our safety, OK?

YOUNG MAN:I’m going home.

NATE LHOWE:Yeah, that’s why we’re stopping you to talk to you.

YOUNG MAN:I am going home!

NATE LHOWE:When you start pulling away—

Det. WILBERTO RUIZ:Right here, right here, I’m talking to you.

YOUNG MAN:I didn’t pull away from nobody!

Det. WILBERTO RUIZ:Look, we ain’t going to do that.

JELANI COBB:So was that a good stop, not a good stop?

Sgt. JOSEPH CONZENTINO:You know what? It starts at the point where they encounter him. I would have to read the report to see exactly how that unfolded, but I understand that by perception, by perception only, that would look like it was a bad stop—by perception.

JELANI COBB:I think what disturbed me most about that video was that I think if I had been in that position, I would have pulled away, too, almost by human instinct. If you’re surrounded by people who are coming at you in a rush, you’re going to back up. And that was kind of seen as justification for—

Sgt. JOSEPH CONZENTINO:See, I understand what you’re saying, but this is where we differ. See, my thing is—and again, if I get stopped by the police and I am a police officer, I listen. I routinely put my hand, if I’m in a car, up on the roof. I take all the precautions, too.

But in that situation there or in any situation, I think I would have complied. I understand what your instincts are, but when you say you’re being surrounded, you’re being surrounded by officers that you can clearly see are officers. I don’t believe it had to go there, if he would’ve just—

JELANI COBB:But see, this is the thing, like, the key difference, which is that, you know, kind of being surrounded by police is not a position in which you feel like you’re safe for someone like me.

Sgt. JOSEPH CONZENTINO:I understand that.

JELANI COBB:I would say, you know., “I don’t know what’s happening here. I don’t know the agenda of these people is.” I know I’m surrounded.

The idea of complying is, like, sure, that may be your second thought. Your immediate thought is, you know, “I’m in jeopardy.” Like, “What’s happening here?” I think that, fundamentally, the difference is, do you—if you’re surrounded by police officers, do you feel more safe or less safe than you were two minutes earlier?

Sgt. JOSEPH CONZENTINO:And what needs to be is that you need to feel like you’re safe and that you can explain, and then the situation is over. It’s not that way right now.

JELANI COBB:In that moment you’re actually about to make a stop on this person, where is your head?

Sgt. JOSEPH CONZENTINO:I’ll admit there’s times when I have fear. And I think fear is probably one of your best friends. And there are times when you hear gunshots, and we have to run to those shots. Most people can’t equate or understand what’s that’s about.

Your heart rate, when it starts to increase, and you know, you’re running, and then you’re going to encounter someone and you may ultimately have to wrestle with that person. You got some bad people out there that have no problem going to the mat with a police officer and trying to take their gun and maybe even using it against them. So I don’t think anybody could ever understand the stress of the situation.